Hi all,
After our last game, and some good combat results, where we took out the odd hunter & scored 2 points for victory, I am thinking it might be a good idea next time (Sat night) to take out the hunters initially while they are spread out over Europe & isolated from each other.
Especially at night.
What do you all think ? Getting the 2 extra points is a big boost.
Was I just getting lucky with combat rolls ? The general consesus seems to be that Drac should run & never fight.
Thanks !
Your chances really depend on how well equipped the hunter is. And the first night is your best chance to catch one without good tools.
It is risky but there are a few people who like to go that route. You just want to make sure that you have your escape well planned.
It's very situational.
In general, Dracula should not initiate combat. There are times that it may be worth his while, but they need to be planned carefully.
This is what I am not getting. Drac has more health & more tactics at his disposal (at night), so Drac should win.
And he can escape pretty easily.
However, it then reveals him and makes it much more apparent where Dracula will be during the Day, when he is much weaker. The Hunters then can try to intercept and take him down during the day. If Hunter #1 finds Dracula's location during the day, Hunter #2 then move there and fight him on his turn. Then Hunter #3 could move there and also fight him. Same with Hunter #4. They can wear him down and whittle down any good Event Cards that Dracula has in his hand. This is not to mention that some of the equipment that a Hunter may have can be downright nasty.
Situational ambushes followed by a good escape plan can be useful, but it is always a big risk once you reveal where you are because of the potential day-time pile-on.
Well, yes. Kinda.
But even if you attack during the first night, the hunter is likely to have one or even two items effective against you. And with one or two lucky rolls he will get away wounded.
Killing a full strength hunter is hard.
And if you attack on your turn but it is the hunter who escapes, then now the hunters are hot on your trail and have a full round to get closer to you, while the hunter has the choice to either stay and fight, if he sees it as a chance to get you, or run out of reach if he doesn't.
So, as it was said before. It is situational. If a hunter stumbled across your trail and is already weakened by some encounters and it is early in the night. Then go for it. If you can arrange for Mina Harker to stumble across your current location during the first step of night, absolutely go for it.
But overall, remain aware that it is a lot easier for the hunters to heal up than it is for you. And even if you manage to kill one in your first night, it's still a long way to victory and if that first kill cost you too much blood, it may proove to be your downfall afterall.
OK, good points there, especially the fact that once you are revealed the hunters can all race over & join the fray.
At the start of the game they are fairly spread out so should take them a while to get there ?
Might check some house rules that beef up Drac a bit..
In my experience the game is very well balanced as it is. Considering the huge payoff (one third of his required victory points) that Dracula stands to gain from defeating a hunter, there should be considerable risk involved. Also a clever drac has quiet a few options to tweak his chances already. There's custom's controls, there's encounters that give you information or just remove cards, there's helpful event cards for the battle, etc.
If Dracula chooses his battle wisely and prepares appropriately, he is a pretty invincible beefy guy already, leaving the hunter with nothing but the hope of rolling lucky for an escape. And if Dracula doesn't choose and prepare wisely, well then he doesn't deserve that win anyway.
when dracula, i tend to get an isolated mina harker at nighttime: she only needs one bite to be defeated.
and the victory points from defeating a hunter i treasure deeply
Yes, the Hunter players really should learn to protect Mina because of that and not let her get too isolated. She's a favorite target of mine as well, but you do have to be worried later in the game. Her ability oft makes her the best equipped Hunter. Though a well-timed "Customs Search" event on an isolated Mina makes her an obvious target.
It may seem this way, but it's really not the case.
It depends a lot on what Items the Hunter has, firstly, so I'll start by saying a Hunter with no or few Items is probably a fairly safe bet, at night anyway and aside from the other point made about revealing your location to other Hunters. His best offensive cards, while powerful, will have a hard time scoring against certain Hunter items, even when he wins the roll and some of his escape cards have disastrous results if he fails a roll against certain items.
Lastly, risk/rewards: a Hunter win can either cripple Dracula, severely limiting his options for the rest of the game, or can outright win the game... A Dracula win might get him some victory points.
I'd agree with Christoph that care should be taken here. The game is pretty well balanced as-is. Making Dracula too potent in combat could very easily overbalance the game to Dracula.
Remember that the Hunters have to beat Dracula in combat to win while Dracula can win without ever fighting.
It's also true to the source material... In the novel, Dracula seemed overwhelmingly powerful at first, but as soon as the Hunters knew what they were up against and how to arm themselves, Dracula ran and did his best to evade them.
OK we had our regular game & Drac's trail was picked up early & got smashed in combat & the game was over in one hour.
Back to the drawing board...
You realize that this is part of the game right? That is how the hunters win. Sure sometimes they will get lucky. Its part of the game... If this continually happens then it is a problem. But if your drac player is half decent it shouldn't.
I've seen things go both ways. I played a few weeks ago a game where I won as the result of kicking Mina's behind twice in something like 4 turns early.
We played tonight and the Dracula player went after Mina first night. The problem was Mina had gotten lucky and had a stake. She nailed Dracula twice with it before the combat was over and poor Dracula was behind the 8 ball just 30 minutes into the game.
Basically same strategy with dramatically different results. It's a strategy that can work for you but it's a high risk high reward sort of thing.
Yep, as a rookie, I wasn't aware of the whole "go after Mina" thing, now I know !
Attacking Mina at night at the start of the game is a bit risky, since Mina tend to equip herself faster. Mina takes 3 moves til night: that is 3 to 6 items. She will likely have a stake, possibly two stakes And Dracula player usually doesn't have many effective event cards at this moment. I would rather go for Lord Godalming: it happens that he usually has the little luck with items, and his items are more against minions. Even though he will not be dead after first bite, the player will have to do something with it and lose time.
But the game is more about hiding, seeking, planning and guessing than about fighting. It's not a fight that makes this game interesting. So I prefer not to cross with hunters at all as long as possible, like using fog and bats encounters when any hunter is too close. Fog and bats placed on "Hide" power is also ideal way to protect a vampire spawn!
I absolutely think attacking hunters at night is a worthwhile venture. Van Helsing (really low hp, can be clawed to death) and Mina are your best targets, with Mina being the preferred. Drac has the ultimate offense and defense at night.
Your opening move should always be Strength if you suspect a stake. Even if they win that match up with a stake, you only take damage not a kill result. If you win, the stake is destroyed and they are probably helpless. Then you try to land the bite. If they have two stakes, or it turns out it was not a good idea Drac's various escapes can't be beat. Mist beats everything, and Escape as a Bat can be used to get far away from the hunters when they are right on your track. It's like an unearthly swiftness out of nowhere, but better because your first location doesn't go in your trail (or you can just move one away to mess with em'). Attacking also puts all the focus on you, and if Hunters think they can kill you they will frequently ignore the rest of your trail. This is perfect if you have a vampire stashed away. If you have cards like rage, or trap, attacking becomes an even better option. 2 points is nothing to sneeze at. The main thing, is spacing. You want other hunters at least 2 moves away or more from the site of your combat. But even if they resolve on you at night, or use a fast horse- Dracula is really powerful at night.
Don't be afraid friends, get your Dracula in there. He is the prince of darkness after all. You're basically invincible at night if you play it right.
